‘Wait for the masterpiece, the work that captures your imagination’

Jussi Pylkkanen: Marijke, do you remember the very first work that you bought together with Willem for the collection?

Marijke Cordia Van der Laan: Before we bought our Van Gogh and Monet paintings [in December 1995 and January 1996], we didn’t actually plan to have a collection as such. We were just buying for decoration for our home. But with the Van Gogh and the Monet, we suddenly decided that we had to be more careful, and to make real decisions about what was going to match the standards set by these two works. But to answer your question, actually there is only one work remaining in the collection which we bought together in 1988, and that is the Karel Appel.

That would be the great Karel Appel painting of 1961 entitled Flowering Heads, which is currently on loan to the COBRA museum?

Yes, it sort of belongs there, they didn’t have an Appel like that and this is one of the things that we really like to do at Triton: we want people to enjoy our works; we want people to have the opportunity to admire them.

Do you have other works on loan elsewhere?

Oh yes, in fact the Van Gogh and the Degas Après le Bain, when they are not travelling or requested for other exhibitions, are at the Van Gogh Museum. This is a nice combination for the museum because they actually don’t have a Degas like that, and at the moment they cannot acquire such a work, so it is a ‘win-win’ situation. Between 40 and 60 per cent of the collection can be travelling at any one time, with works going as far afield as Seoul or Cleveland.

Can I ask now about the family’s outlook on collecting? You have a new generation, and are moving in new directions with purchases by artists such as Sean Scully and Marina Abramovich. The broader family are interested in helping form the next steps for the collection, how did this interest come about?

Well, my daughter Eliane had studied the Christie’s Fine Art course for a year in London, and then my daughter-in-law Marlies did the same thing later in 2010. Back in 2003 Eliane persuaded us to buy a Martial Raysse, which we still have. My husband didn’t really like it, but I said we had to encourage the younger generation (and I did sort of like it, it was very Pop). So we bought it, and to Willem’s surprise it appreciated rather quickly in value and he said, ‘Wow, she has an eye for this’. In the same year we bought our first Fontana, another of Eliane’s suggestions and to which Willem was again sceptical. And then when Waring Hopkins came to us on 2004 with an Yves Klein also from the 1960s, Eliane and I were able to say to Willem ‘This is so beautiful you have to buy this’ and Willem didn’t hesitate any more. On reflection, I think that that is really one of the defining things about our collection, that we developed a way of choosing together by consensus. Of course we all get a lot out of working together in making decisions about the collection.

Fernand Léger (1881-1955), Danseuse au tambourin, 1954. Gouache, India ink and traces of pencil on paper. 27 5/8 x 21½ in. Estimate: €250,000-350,000

So could we summarise that some of the works that you are selling now are from periods you stopped collecting, as the new chapter began?

Yes I think that is true. I would say that the thread that unites the collection has always been the avant garde. So now we are trying to buy the artists who in the future will be looked on as the avant garde of today. But the more you look in to the future the more challenging it is to find something that you hope will prove to be of high quality, or significant rarity in order to match the demands of the collection. Frankly, this is easier to do when you know an artist and their whole body of work: you can immediately say ‘that is very good’ or ‘that is not so good’.

Have you got an example of something that you think is the essence of what you are trying to do with the Triton Collection Foundation in terms of identifying the avant garde of the next generation?

We bought a sculpture by Ai Wei Wei which is a block of tea, and which has been on long-term loan at the Rijksmuseum since 2012. We thought this was a good idea because of the long history the Dutch have with the tea trade. So what better place, in amongst the glowing Rembrandts and other 17th Century masterpieces, for this contemporary piece?

There is absolutely not one work in the sale selection which doesn’t have a special place in my heart

Why the family has decided to sell this group of drawings?

Well, of course there are several reasons. When you start collecting, serious collecting, it is very difficult to stop! You keep on buying because it becomes sort of instinct. Collecting is sort of like hunting, and hunting together in partnership, as I did with Willem before and now with Eliane and Marlies, means that together you hunt the sort of thing you are looking for, and suddenly you say ‘There it is’ — you immediately recognise it. But you have to manage your collection also and not let it grow out of hand. Another reason for the sale is that Willem loved to be surrounded by his art, so we had everything hanging, apart from the works that were in exhibitions. But after the terrible robbery at the Kunsthal [in Rotterdam] in 2012, the situation for all of us changed. Now, a lot of works we can’t hang at home are kept in storage. And this is entirely against our Triton concept: we want people to enjoy the works, and in storage nobody can enjoy them.

Odilon Redon (1840-1916), Rêverie, circa 1900. Pastel and charcoal on paper. 21½ x 14 5/8 in. Estimate: €300,000-500,000

So we can see that you are selling mostly classic Modern works from the collection?

Yes. It is important that the collection to retains a coherent unity. Without compromising the standards of the existing collection, I tried to make a selection that really is a reflection of the quality and the rarity of Triton. But also there is absolutely not one work in the sale selection which doesn’t have a special place in my heart. I love drawings. And of course they each come with dear memories of where we bought them. But I hope, and that is especially why we chose auction, that new admirers will become their owners and that they will enjoy them in turn… It is really that emotional moment that you must have when you look at a piece of art. It is not just a question of appreciation, but each work should really say something to you in an emotional way.

So with the superb Pissarro gouache that you bought back in ’98, what was the essence that made you think, ‘This is for us’?

The quality. Of course we had seen lots and lots of Pissarros, because that was the way we taught ourselves, to go to a lot of exhibitions, and to look and learn. This is the quintessence of becoming an informed buyer later on. This is one of the few pieces that immediately when you see it, even if you are used to seeing his larger paintings, you say “This is something special. If we want to have a Pissarro, it should be this one”.

Camille Pissarro (1830-1903), Paysannes travaillant dans les champs, Pontoise, 1881. Gouache and black chalk on paper. 12 5/8 x 19½ in. Estimate: €250,000-350,000

Do you feel that every object has that sort of uniqueness?

In the beginning we tried to find the perfect picture by the main artists present from 1870 until the mid-1890s. We had a lot of contact with John Leighton, who worked at that time with the Van Gogh Museum. He came often to look at the collection. And of course in the beginning there were lots and lots of gaps. But he always said ‘watch out for gap-filling. Never fill a gap just because you find a painting to do that. Wait for the masterpiece, the work that captures your imagination’.

That is certainly very sound advice. And perhaps something that will inspire buyers in the sale of your works to go on to build a collection of their own in the same way that Triton has grown so successfully?

Yes. Perhaps when they realise suddenly that they have two fantastic pieces, as we did with our Van Gogh and our Degas, they will say “Hey, those two pieces tell me something, maybe I have to collect...”